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  1. #41
    Wawa
    Where's the gamers?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unnamed Newbie View Post
    After a bit of thought, this is what I keep coming back to.

    In a nutshell, I'd rather have a group of veterans with SA powers on my servers than not. Worse case scenario, they aren't active anymore. Best case scenario, you've got a sleeper cell of admins who keep the servers clean and lighten the loads of !calladmin
    Hell, with the recent pandemic, I'd be playing on the servers right now due to not having to work long hours like I did before. But, 3600+ hours later, I am completely tired of CSGO and that's the only servers we have. Shit, even CS 1.6 is now the 26th most popular game on steam due to covid giving all games a boost in popularity, I would love to play on a [SG] 1.6 server.

    But actually using admin or not doesn't even matter when it comes to recognition ranks, it's still a symbol of recognition and trust in the eyes of many people for a long time. Taking that away and then turning around to say "well, it wasn't originally meant to be interpreted that way" is like saying the common perceptions of this reality are wrong and mine is right.

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  3. #42
    Spiritwind
    Veteran
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    What is the general purpose of this? Tbh, it kinda felt like a slap in the face to see that there is a lot of long term higher end contributors that just got "demoted" (yes, it is a demotion for those still active). It just seems like yet another way to play favorite. Why change the old system? It worked, and worked for years. What am I not seeing that makes this beneficial to the community in a way other than playing "Popularity Contest".

    If it was a trust issue that resulted in these people demoted, why would they even have Legend to begin with (in the old system)? If they are untrustworthy people, they probably never deserved a higher rank to begin with.

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  5. #43
    Vivian
    SG Professional
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    Give me my Honorable Gamer, damnit

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  7. #44
    Wooper
    SG Addict
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    I see I still don't have Legend/Veteran for my extensive time and effort as a Server Admin for 6 days. Obviously due to @Black Rain's personal vendetta against me, jealous of how close I am with @Nuclear Onion. I'll let it slide.. for now.



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  9. #45
    Caution
    Because I was Inverted
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    Hello everyone,

    I've still been pretty busy at work with this whole pandemic thing, so haven't had a whole lot of time to dedicate here lately it seems. I just wanted to touch base real quick on this change and respond to a couple of things that were mentioned, without getting too in-depth. I am, however, going to lock this thread. This was meant to serve as an announcement, and not really a 'let's hear your feedback' thread. I don't have an issue with people offering their insight / input / memes at all, but that should be taken to another thread in another section. That way, it's kept a bit more serious and can actually have people posting pure input, instead of half memes half input. I think this thread needed a bit of input from a BD though before the conversation carries elsewhere. While I'm not the best person to lead the press conference for this, I figured I should respond a bit to a few things so we're all somewhat on the same page. A lot of this is just my personal opinion.

    Prez brought up a great point about getting out of the 'if it isn't broken...' mindset. That's simply not how every aspect of every angle of life works (and I would argue that most parts of SG aren't looked at with this mindset). Sometimes, things need to be improved upon, expanded, reworked completely, scrapped, etc. This was deemed as one of those things. I'm not really sure how many times in the past we've reworked, whether on the front-end or the back-end, the general concept of an honorary rank - HG, LG, RS, etc. Ranks have been brought back, scrapped, tweaked, etc: I'd guess somewhere around a dozen. Sometimes it's random, and someone happens to come up with an idea and we sort of run with it, and other times it's because we're doing a bit of an overhaul on ranks (sort of like we are now). So I will tell you right now that the argument of 'if it isn't broken...' is not going to hold weight in the majority of circumstances.

    Red pill: I am forever grateful for the work that old-schoolers and new-schoolers alike have poured into this place over the years. Whether it is an admin who has dumped in a ton of hours administrating a server, a CA who busts their ass in meetings, etc - all the work here is appreciated. That, however, does not mean you are immediately and forever automatically entitled to admin forever. I'm not really sure where that notion comes from - but I want to make that extremely clear: you are not, in any way / shape / form, entitled to permanent administrative powers on the servers. The time that you have put sacrificing away from families, work, school, or just because you are bored, was not done under the illusion of being promised admin powers forever. We happened to have a rank (LG) that granted this power to everyone, because we figured 'why not', and never bothered reworking the system since the last time RS went to LG because it never got brought up. Now that we are redoing ranks, it made sense when the topic was brought up about re-doing the LG system.

    A lot of you bringing up how enraged you are haven't touched a server in months / years. On top of that, if some of you really want to go in-depth about the work you put in: I've been around for a pretty decent amount of time, and was privy to seeing some of the 'work' (or lack thereof) that was put in. The demotion discussions, the missed promises, the punishments, etc. I'm not going to go more in-depth than that because I don't want to discredit anyone's actual work they did put in here: just know that some of the names I've read in these threads either saying certain things themselves or just being mentioned by another...there are oftentimes a lot that you do not know on the back end of things and a lot of dirty laundry that I don't particularly care to air in public.

    You being trusted at a certain rank years ago has literally zero to do with being trusted with administrative powers on the server today; those two things are apples and oranges. People with administrative powers on the servers are, typically, expected to maintain a certain level of activity, and actually be involved with forum discussions for any type of rule changes. While this definitely does apply to a few LG's, 98% fall into the category of not meeting the standard criteria of what we typically require. Even I go onto subforums / read the MOTD in depth before playing on a server I haven't touched in awhile - or I just don't use admin powers unless it's against one of the universal SG rules. It has nothing to do with 'well you trusted me at one point so I am forever trusted'. Well...no, not really. I may trust that you're a nice guy, can come on the forums without being an ass, etc., but that trust does not blindly extend to you administrating servers when you haven't even been around in years. That's not saying I don't personally trust anyone falling into that category - but moreso it's not just a giant blanket of trust for anything and everything relating to admin powers.

    As mentioned above, we just had a rank where people just sort of landed into permanent admin powers. After evaluating the discussion brought up weeks ago and then this thread in recent terms, I would rather just see admin removed entirely from LG as well. I have no idea where the notion came that people were entitled to admin forever, but I just want to cut extremely to the point and point-blank say that has not, is not, never has been, never will be, the case. Every aspect of this community is flexible and open to the possibility of change, at any point in time, in any capacity.

    I'm sorry that some of you guys viewed this as a demotion, but it's not meant to be. The same way that when we moved from AO to AT, it wasn't an AO demotion - it was the Board moving the community into another direction that is overall thought of as being right. Nobody likes to have powers removed - in any capacity, so I get it. However, you have to understand that us giving you admin powers on the servers is not the only possible way for us to give you recognition. If you think that it is, I'm not quite sure what to tell you. What I can say, however, is I will never, ever personally support giving someone admin for life after reading this thread and seeing how many people think that it is entitled because you put in work here. I would rather it just be removed and us give it back on a case-by-case basis for those old-schoolers who do want to come back and administrate for a bit.

    Once again, thanks to everyone over the years for your work. I genuinely do appreciate it. Our appreciation, however, does not start & end based on the amount of permissions we give you here.

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