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VirDeBello
02-19-2008, 03:53 PM
Well I just wanted to open a debate (not an arguement or flame) of what people think of America's future. I hope topics like this are acceptable. Some scholars suggest the America has the symptoms of a dying super power similar to the past great empires of the world. I am on the debate team for my school and this topic is often debated almost every time we met. Our debate team was formed in the middle of the year so we aren't registered to enter compitetions but we still talk of current events and the future with my cool ass English teacher. Best English teacher I ever had and he formed it up. But enough of that, do you believe America will fall?

What I believe is that empires die. There is no empire that has stood the test of time and the test of corruption and greed. I think there are two ways America will die out as a super power. The bad way is the Roman way, the way they died out was terrible and the known world entered the Dark Ages. The eastern part just crumbled and became devastated. The western part survived but with its own problems of holding itself together. I would hope not that America would fall like this especially at a time like, terrorism would run amok and their would be chaos.

The other way that America could die out would be the GB way. This situation would be just us stepping down from the position of a superpower to a position of above average power or average power. While it didn't send the world into chaos, the power of GB was greatly reduced, it was still a country of power.

I think the way we are going is the way of the Romans, the political system is too corrupt and maybe its different in other states? Maybe its just what I see in NJ and I assume its like this in all states? But we are becoming too "fancy" we are indulging ourselves in the riches of the modern world and forgetting about the basics, the morales and values. I love this country and the values of freedom and justice all that is said on the Declaration of Independence, I love it. America is like a house, we have added new floors, new additions and other fancy stuff but forgot all about the structure of it all. It may take alot of time, effort and money to fix the rotting structure but in the end you won't have a collapsed house.

MANFRA
02-19-2008, 04:00 PM
Depends this coming election. Either way though, we're screwed unless whoever is elected next is willing to change their mind on taxation, the war in iraq & afghanistan, and our foreign policy. I can't see any of that changing so we're screwed.

Omega
02-19-2008, 04:10 PM
I would hope not that America would fall like this especially at a time like, terrorism would run amok and their would be chaos.

Not if 190+ other nations have something to say about it... you're misinformed when you think every country around the world depends 100% on USA, especially when it comes to combating terrorism.


I don't think that the US is going to "fall" anytime soon. USA isn't what it used to be and others may take the hill it once topped, but it won't cease to exist as a superpower for years to come. But again, in today's world (mainly with nuclear ICBM capabilities) it's hard to predict. So unless there's a global nuclear war and every warhead is pointed at uncle sam, we should be OK. It's all about our future foreign policy.

phatman76
02-19-2008, 07:03 PM
Frankly, the situation today is entirely different from the Romans two thousand years ago and Great Britain 70 years ago. The United States is designed to not fall apart like the Romans did. One president, even a string of ten bad ones, can't screw up our country. The military could never stage a coup or get political either. That throws the Roman thing out the window, they fell in on themselves because there was no separation of powers, the USA will not.

As for the Great Britain thing, the United States is still extensively powerful without exploiting the resources of other nations. China will run out of coal a long time before we do. Economically, we are still the lynch pin of the globe. Even if someone overtakes us, we will still be for the foreseeable future.

Finally, the whole ICBM and military thing factors in. If the United States never falls like the Romans, neither will its military. While we aren't tyrants, our interests are protected. I don't care how many people China has, nothing speaks louder than a carrier fleet twenty miles off your coast, and we are the only people with more than one of those.

Don't presume history will repeat itself...

EvInReaLife
02-19-2008, 08:13 PM
I think of america as the cop of the world. Whenever freedom is threatened, we are there. Also, the views our founding fathers set forth are still valued today, also the bill of rights was only changed a few times. America's views on the people of the world should live have no doubt influenced the world. Many countries see the USA as a romodel, even going as far to almost copy our bill of rights. Freedom is good. America is the last great hope for our planet, and anyone who says otherwise is completely oblivious to the world around him.

MANFRA
02-20-2008, 10:57 AM
I think of america as the cop of the world. Whenever freedom is threatened, we are there. Also, the views our founding fathers set forth are still valued today, also the bill of rights was only changed a few times. America's views on the people of the world should live have no doubt influenced the world. Many countries see the USA as a romodel, even going as far to almost copy our bill of rights. Freedom is good. America is the last great hope for our planet, and anyone who says otherwise is completely oblivious to the world around him.

Your right, but we shouldn't hold our grreat democracy up so much where we think we have the right to shove it down other countries throats whether they like it or not. That makes us look bad.

VirDeBello
02-20-2008, 05:50 PM
lol Ima an honorable gamer.

Then what of the decline in vaules and morales and the plain stupidity in this country? Again........maybe its because I live in NJ and I assume the rest of the country is like that also, but it seems that everyone complains about the minorities having no education but they seem to have no interest in learning anyways. There is a big gap between the smart and the plain stupid. Either you know alot about your subjects and classes or you know nothing. Hmmmm.........perhaps I am just paranoid.

phatman76
02-20-2008, 07:59 PM
lol Ima an honorable gamer.

Then what of the decline in vaules and morales and the plain stupidity in this country? Again........maybe its because I live in NJ and I assume the rest of the country is like that also, but it seems that everyone complains about the minorities having no education but they seem to have no interest in learning anyways. There is a big gap between the smart and the plain stupid. Either you know alot about your subjects and classes or you know nothing. Hmmmm.........perhaps I am just paranoid.

There is always a gap between the smart and the stupid dude, that is why we have those terms. If you think there are way more stupid people in an worse ratio than before, you are wrong though. Way more people go to college today than before, and get educated and smart. As for moral values, there has been a decline, but most moral values are a choice, they have nothing to do with law or government.

Omega
02-20-2008, 08:57 PM
As for moral values, there has been a decline, but most moral values are a choice, they have nothing to do with law or government.

Not directly no, but media makes a huge impact. And guess who's the media's favorite bumbuddy. Corrrrrrrrrrrrrect answer!

EvInReaLife
02-20-2008, 09:19 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0GOW6aAZGDE

Is there such a thing as being overly patriotic?

Omega
02-20-2008, 10:01 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0GOW6aAZGDE

Is there such a thing as being overly patriotic?

yes...it's called fanaticism.

phatman76
02-20-2008, 10:33 PM
yes...it's called fanaticism.

I have never met an American who is a "fanatic" patriot. A fanatic is so willing to do what his leaders tell him that he will leave his country to attack another as an insurgent, that he would blow himself up in a marketplace to terrorize people.

I believe the crazy nut-patriot of the USA is basically a media exaggeration.

Also, one more point on stupid people. Since the IQ test was invented in the early 1900's, the "average" intelligence has been steadily raised. A person who scored 100 (average) on the test 80 years ago would score about 80 today. People aren't get stupider, society is just getting more complex. It is increasingly difficult to be good enough to function in this society. People can't somehow become smarter to deal with all the new tech and stuff we have, so they just know it less well in general.

Omega
02-20-2008, 10:59 PM
I didn't point the finger at anyone. Look at his question, and look at my answer.